Random thoughts and rants on boat design, boat building, and other boat bits for those in the 99%...
Stolen raccoons, exploding whales, and in the "Milk with Dignity" department...
Atom Voyager has taken the whole outboard conversion process to a level approaching art and there is a lot to be learned by following along while an artist works his magic.
Color me impressed.
Listening to Arny Margret
So it goes...
Seems about right, a question for today, and in the "Just when you thought it was all back to normal" department...
Voile Magazine has an excellent article covering two identical sailboats with different propulsion systems.
Which, in my opinion, is well worth dusting off the Google translate if you don't happen to speak French.
Listening to Monsieur Periné
So it goes...
A sobering point, some steps in the right direction, and the Antarctic heat wave continues...
I just saw a 2.5 HP British Seagull motor for sale in Washington on Craig's List for the princely sum of $95! As someone who loves things pared down to the bare necessities, to say that I admire Seagull outboards would be an understatement.
According to the seller, the motor works well and my experience with Seagulls tells me that it's typical for their motors to keep going forever.
Did I mention that the motor in question was built in 1956?
Of course, when asked if he would be willing to ship it to the Caribbean, the seller did not want the hassle of taking a motor to the local post office (bummer), but it did get me thinking...
The Seagull is a real exercise in simplicity and, as such, the idea of just building a reasonable facsimile is not out of reach of even the most ham-fisted DIYer.
Being that it's 2022 and I really hate internal combustion engines, the home-cobbled Seagull I'm seeing in my head is going to be an electric motor that resembles a 66-year old Seagull.
I'm guessing the power source will be either 18V Ryobi or surplus 32V electric bike/scooter batteries. As I'm heavily invested in Ryobi tools, it kind of makes sense on one level but the large number of scooter/bike batteries available lends itself to the more oomph side of things. That said, the optimum HP needed for an eight foot pram dinghy is really only about 1HP so the Ryobi option might actually make more sense.
Obviously I have some more stuff to work through but it's going on lunchtime and I have to do the galley thing. Hopefully, more soon come.
Listening to Phosphorescent
So it goes...
Chuck Wendig with a must read, a moment in history, and in the "It appears that someone thinks wind power is a good investment" department...
As I have some work to do and really can't come up with anything interesting to write, here's an electric foiling catamaran that just might entertain you for a moment.
Listening to the Punch Brothers
So it goes...
A reasonable excuse, something interesting about cheese, and in the "Not at all surprising" department...
While I enjoy rowing I'll be the first to admit that on occasion a small outboard is no bad thing. I use the word 'small' because when I do the need/want test I find that what I need to power a small displacement dinghy to hull speed is just around 1HP.
Now, if you think about, it one horse power is actually a whole lot of energy and hardly a thing that is a candidate for derision. Trust me it will move your boat just fine.
Of course, our consumerist overlords don't seem willing to produce a one horse power outboard engine and these days finding a 2HP engine has become quite the problematic exercise.
The old air cooled 2-stroke Cruise N Carry outboard with 1.5HP was actually a pretty good motor as it was simple, easy to fix, and only weighed twelve pounds. The downside was being air-cooled and two-stroke it was a noisy little sucker.
It seems obvious, to me at least, that the way to go with a small outboard these days is going electric. There are lots of little trolling motor that would push your little displacement dinghy just fine.
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| Saturn 65pond thrust/1 HP motor |
The problems with little trolling motors for a cruiser is that while the motors are relatively inexpensive and light they do require a largish battery to make them work. The idea of having to wrangle a 100AH battery in and out of the dinghy on a regular basis as well as having to charge the battery does not induce a warm and fuzzy feeling.
There is one little electric outboard that checks off most of my list and that's the EP Carry which is a great design but somewhat pricey at $1600. Especially when considering that an electric weed wacker can be bought for less than $200.
Did I really just say weed wacker?
Think about that for a moment... It's an electric motor on a stick that turns something. While, granted, a polypro string is not exactly a great way to push your dinghy through the water it does not seem all that difficult of a stretch to imagine that one could attach a propeller to such a beast and see what happens.
Listening to ADG7
So it goes...
What's in your tuna fish sandwich, some needful drought news, and in the "common sense or radical environmentalism" department...
Since I'm thinking about a new dinghy I've also been thinking long and hard about a one HP electric outboard to go with it.
More about that soonish.
Listening to a harp-centric cover
So it goes...
Some good points on the subject of accountability, a ski/climate artwork that says it all, and in the "Just how stupid can you get" department...
Every once in a while I get the urge to try something I think is pretty stupid and I’m sure I’m not alone in this.
For instance, take the all-electric sailboat as an example. At first glance, it makes sense. I’d love to get rid of fossil fuels aboard “So It Goes”. The idea of being able to generate all the required energy with solar is the stuff of dreams I’ve had for decades.
I follow just about everything I can get on various schemes and tech that makes the idea of an all-electric boat doable.
The problem I keep running into is that a lot of the folks doing the all-electric boat gig keep their actual power use compared to power harvested information to themselves. Add in sorting your way through various instruments, refrigeration, stoves, inverters, watermakers, washing machines, appliances, and other bits of electrical draw consume in the real world.
Concerning efficiency of devices, there is very little information available. Electrical systems suffer from the ‘death of a thousand cuts’ syndrome, where a system that should work fails when a surplus of minor losses combine and result in unplanned for loads which can cause failure.
Which is a roundabout way saying that what I'd like is a whole lot more information and some serious studies on how, for instance, a modern electric stove would compare to either an alcohol, kerosene, diesel, or propane stove. The same goes for pretty much any system that one is considering to add or replace with an electric alternative. Anybody seen such a beast?
Some more thoughts on electrical systems soonish...
Listening to David Byrne and Yo Le Tengo cover a Yoko Ono song
So it goes...
Well this is scary/interesting, but this ruined my whole day, and something of a palate cleanser in the "Rich men behaving badly" department...
The other day, someone I know was complaining about the high cost of electric propulsion systems for sailboats and it got me thinking.
Since I've had three different electric propulsion systems aboard "So It Goes" I actually understand what what works and what doesn't as well as what stuff actually costs.
Obviously, the real issue, where electric propulsion costs are concerned, is not so much that the various parts are expensive but that the marine trades tend to inflate those costs because it's all about making money.
For my first system I used an Etek motor ($200), a replacement controller for a golf cart ($100), an aluminum mounting bracket($30) for thirty bucks and an assortment of sprockets and chain for the actual power transmission ($100). The electrical control bits were bought at Radio Shack ($15) and worked just fine. The actual motor mount was cobbled together with some scrap plywood I had on the boat.
Hardly an expensive installation.
As far as the battery bank went I used six-volt golf cart batteries in a 48-volt 200 AH bank.which, admittedly, was far too expensive and heavy in my opinion.
That said, the system worked extremely well once I'd sorted out some overheating issues with the Etek motor. As to the reason why the motor was overheating it was that at extreme low speeds (most of how I actually used the motor) the combination of cooling optimized for high speed use combined with the higher amp loads at lower voltages. The fix was fairly simple and just involved a change in gearing to let the motor run at a higher speed.
The other day I saw a very interesting Chinese EV which costs all of $2000. with lithium batteries included. Now, at $2000 you'd have just about all the bits needful to make an electric propulsion rig for a sailboat. I'd certainly consider buying one of these pickup/dump trucks, taking it apart, and adapting the drive train to turn the prop shaft aboard "So It Goes" for about the same cost of a 6HP outboard or about 10% of what a Marine grade system would cost you...
So maybe we should not be complaining about the high cost of marine EV systems but instead looking at adapting more reality based costing of commercial EV systems that are already out there.
Listening to the Isley Brothers
So it goes...
Some needful reading on the subject of masks, regarding Google's creative bookkeeping, and in the "You just can't fix stupid" department...
This caught my eye because it's pretty much just my old ETEK based Mark 1 electric drive which worked pretty well and was both affordable and pretty easy for just about anyone to cobble together on a budget.
Simple works.
Listening to a bardish playlist
So it goes...
Badtux reflecting on life during a plague, some timely provisioning/cooking advice, and in the "Pick a good anchorage because you may be there for a while" department...
Here's an impressive and very cool little car.
With a 5.5 kWh battery and 6 kW engine. The microcar has a range of 70 kilometers (43.5 miles) on a single charge...
Which is pretty much my wishlist for what I want in an electric propulsion system for a cruising sailboat....comes with a battery that can be powered from a standard electrical socket in just three hours.
Some excellent, if somewhat upsetting, journalism well worth reading, a good point being made, and in the "you may want to stock up on DEET" department...
So, it would appear that Jim Antrim has designed a scow of some interest to those in the know for Barry Spanier.
An important milestone, a concise (if a bit self-promoting) history of surfboards, and a very good point...
NASA's OMG, a brief history, and in the "voter suppression/stealing elections" department...
I was recently reading an online exchange regarding electric propulsion and found it nearly impossible not to start banging my head against the nearest available bulkhead. My problem being that while both sides of the argument were very passionate neither seemed to have done their homework or bothered to look at the big picture. To call it a mess would be something of an understatement.
Granted, electric propulsion on boats of a certain size is, at best, going to be a problematic affair fraught with many obstacles, dead ends, and a propensity for inducing insanity but still, for some, a viable propulsion choice with a great many advantages.
So why is everyone getting it all wrong? Seriously, color me all kinds of perplexed...
The answers ARE out there.
There is a large body of good information on the subject available so no need to re-invent the wheel (pun intended) and it should be quite easy to do the research then cookbook an appropriate system. All that's left is doing your your need/want test and cost benefit analysis. Sure it requires some work but no rocket science involved.
Apparently, for a lot of folks, it's more about feelings, making it up as you go along, or tRumpian logic. None of which will get you where you want to go. On the other hand, they do make for head banging inducing discussions that don't make a whole lot of sense.
The bottom line is there are a lot of good reasons to go or not go with electric propulsion... It's a complicated subject. Most of what I hear these days from both sides of the discussion does not make sense. Do your own research, avoid the forums/YouTube, and be very wary of people trying to sell you something.
Just saying...
Listening to Weir & Oates
So it goes...
Small being the new "it", a noteworthy post, and a small price to pay...
They had me with the word "integrated".
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| More information here |
Inspired timing, some interesting numbers, and something interesting about coral...
Here's a question you might want to ponder while you go about your daily business...
Why does this...
This just might make your head explode, hardly a surprise, and folks keep telling me things are looking up but not so much the numbers...
Some times change is hard and you find yourself jumping through all sorts of hoops to avoid the reality of the need/want voice that is whispering in your ear...
I'm pretty sure that anyone who has been reading this blog knows I'm a huge booster of the whole electric propulsion bandwagon. Fact is, I'm pretty sure I've been promoting and using electric propulsion even before the band got their wagon (so to speak). So, it might surprise you that I'm in the process of removing a perfectly good electric propulsion system on "So It Goes" in favor of a more engine-less approach.
Our current Electric Yacht system has worked flawlessly. It does everything a propulsion system should, has no real maintenance costs or issues, pretty much keeps itself charged through regeneration, and provides plenty of power when needed. What's not to like?
Liking my system, actually, is a big part of the problem. It is such an awesome piece of gear that even though I really don't use it, I want to keep it because not too many things on a boat work so well. As a result, I'm just that little bit reluctant to follow my rule that, if it's on the boat and I'm not using it, it should be gone.
We sail and never make passages under power. Which, as it happens, is not what I think YOU should do but it is what makes us happy. The downside of that is from time to time we find ourselves sitting with no wind... waiting and, I would be dishonest if I did not say that I hate sitting waiting for wind but since I actually hate motoring more it is the lesser evil. Then again we're not in any sort of a hurry to get anywhere so it is a lot easier for us to roll with the flow than for some.
When we have very little wind I actually enjoy it because it's a great game keeping the momentum going following the tiniest of wind shifts. It's good practice because it teaches you how to really sail with something approaching finesse and, dare I say it, art.
Of course, the fact is, the more you sail the less you need a motor and the less you need a motor the more you sail is a spiral that not everyone understands or appreciates. Or not until one day you realize that you have not turned on your motor for over a year and all of a sudden that motor and its related baggage is just taking up space and payload that could be better used in some other way.
Now I'm pretty sure some of the diesel heads who read this might jump to the conclusion that removing our motor is somehow a failure of electric propulsion and they would be wrong. The thing is, if we had a Saab diesel installed on the boat it would be getting the same exact treatment and be looking for a new home... It's not about the type of propulsion, it is simply about the fact that we simply don't need any sort of inboard propulsion system whether it be gas/diesel/electric.
We do have a 6HP outboard we can use if/when needed and I'm in the process of planning out some 16-18 foot sweeps and oarlocks so I can row or scull if needful but that's mostly because I've always been a belt and braces kind of guy.
For the next boat, if I were to put in an inboard propulsion system, I'm 99.99% sure it would be an electric system especially if I were building it myself because then I'd be able to design in the battery bank as an integral component of the ballast which would seriously rock... That said, I'm pretty sure it still would not get used very much.
Listening to David Bowie
So it goes...
About that report on environmental impact, BP guilty of eleven felonies but no jail time, and in the we-are-so-screwed-when-guys-like-this-are-running-the-show department...
There's an observation in the film "Longitude" (or the book) where the man set the task of repairing the clock notes that the designer never ever went back and changed anything but simply beavered forward with fixes on top of fixes on top of fixes...
Well, I'll admit I'm not so sure how common this state of affairs is in clock design, but it is a standard operating procedure where boats are concerned!
I'm well aware of this because, while I strive for a simpler boat, I find myself battling the cancer of over-complication on a daily basis and most of this is caused by simply wanting to keep forward momentum and not wanting to backtrack on problems.
Or, as Joe Pike would say, "The only direction I know is forward"...
Now, I'm sure, where Joe Pike is concerned, forward really is the only way to go but as far as boat design, systems, and suchlike, not so much.
Take our electric propulsion system for instance...
We chose to go with electric propulsion because it was simple, reliable, and affordable. For as much as we used an engine it made sense and once we set down that path there was no looking back.
Over the years as things changed and the EP system evolved, it started getting a bit more complicated in terms of related systems (chargers, solar, genset, etc) because I kept adding things. Hardly surprising that half a dozen years later we are now looking at a much more complicated and admittedly kludgey system than what we used to have.
That said, while currently over-complicated and kludgey, it is still, in my opinion, simpler and superior to a diesel for our needs...
But, while researching more and more stuff related to the VolksCruiser concept I found myself looking at electric propulsion in a different light and found it wanting (for those anti-EP folks I should point out that for the VolksCruiser, diesel sucks as well).
The fact is, I was only able to do this because the VolksCruiser is pretty much a blank sheet of paper with no preconceptions and, as such, very different from the problem solving I deal with on "So It Goes" where almost all of the systems are in place and I have those Joe Pike tattoos pointing me ever forward.
Time to get out a clean white sheet of paper...
Listening to the Youngbloods
So it goes...
Bad timing, Colbert gets it right, and a guitar of note...
Having a blog related to boat stuff of the sailing variety leads to various interesting, as well as, surprising conversations...
For instance, whenever I post something related to electric propulsion it's a given that I will get at least a few folks writing in to explain to me the error of my ways.
"The technology is simply not there yet..."Is the most common argument. I won't go in to why the technology IS there for some of us but, suffice to say that this sort of discussion is a staple of the mailbag.
"An electric drive might work for you, but, where I live, I have to have an engine because I have to be able to motor against wind and tide on a regular basis..."Is it just me or is there something wrong with that last statement?
Boy, am I in the wrong business, Archdruid on interesting times ahead, and I don't expect this is going to surprise anyone...
The other day someone over at the Junk Rig Association website shared some details of his electric propulsion set up and made some good points in the process. The resulting discussion made me realize a couple of things though not exactly about electric motors...
Just about every discussion about electric propulsion on the web seems to include some naysayer with highly inflated estimates of what an electric propulsion system will cost. So much so that almost everyone believes that it's a non-negotiable fact that electric drives are much more expensive than a diesel engine.
Part of the problem is that there are some really silly-expensive systems floating around of the "There's one born every minute so let's screw them and make a quick buck" piratical marine trades sort... You know the kind, geared to idiots who think paying $1800 for a $600 motor some how makes it, you know, better.
The thing is, living in 2012 (the internet being a wonderful thing) it's easy to check out what stuff should cost by going to the source and looking up the price and seeing what stuff does cost. Trust me, it beats listening to the guy on that forum who knows what stuff costs because he knew a guy, who knew a guy, who met a guy in a bar who had one...
Which brings us to one of the most important rules about boat gear...
Do your own math!Listening to Little Feat
Michael, sadly, just might have a valid point, an excellent write up on the new RockBox over at L-36, and a book I'm really looking forward to...
A designer of boats I know and respect recently pointed out that electric propulsion does not make any sense. Her reasoning runs along the lines of "I tried it and it did not work like I thought it should so it simply does not work"...
On the other hand, I know a number of people using electric propulsion who have systems that work just fine and are very happy campers.
Something of a conundrum that!
As it happens, this is not really about electric motors on boats but about how expectations or how you embrace something tends to affect the outcome... Electric propulsion just happens to be a good example.
The thing is, ideas that are a little outside the box require a little outside-the-box-thought-process to actually work. From where I sit, this seems like a foregone conclusion but every day I see examples that tell me my thinking is way off base.
Electric propulsion is sorta/kinda different than internal combustion based propulsion systems and as a result you sorta/kinda have to approach it a little differently. If you approach it the same as internal combustion you're in for some serious disappointment because it's different... In a sorta/kinda way.
Different, apparently, is difficult for a lot of people to deal with. Most folk like the same old same because the it's the same and they don't have to do anything hard like modify their thought process, change how they do things, or swim upstream against popular opinion.
I mention this as something to keep in mind as it might come in handy in the not too far distant future.
You might want to look around you and see just how some folks are being successful outside the box... That cruiser who seems happy sailing on a miniscule budget you can't even imagine living on, or that guy about to build a proa, the couple on a junk rigged schooner, and yes, those folks who seem to be able to manage on a boat without an internal combustion engine. They might actually be on to something!
David Bowie certainly said it better than I ever could...
"Ch-ch-ch-ch-changes Turn and face the strange..."Listening to David Bowie as it happens
